What's up, everybody? Welcome to the European aged six million podcast.
I'm your host to buy his bass.
We're here with a very, very special guest today.
Former NFL head coach Hue Jackson.
How you doing, sir? I'm doing good.
How you doing today? Doing well today? Some nice day.
I'm in Houston, Texas, right now.
After beautiful warm day.
The the winner or the winner? The so called heavy has really hit us yet, so Oh, yeah.
So the home of the Shawn Watson.
Yes, sir. But before I get to the interview today, I want to read something.
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So, sir, so you know, you've cultured a lot of different places, you know, obviously most recently with the with the Browns, the Bangles.
You coach them with the Raiders and the Falcons.
But talk about your overall, you know, Korean NFL as a head coach.
Well, it's, uh, it was been kind of hidden, miss, you know, at the Raiders.
I think it was really good.
Al Davis gave me an opportunity.
Obviously, he's an icon of awesome working for him being around him, learning for him hey past.
And so the organization decided to go in a different direction, which I totally understood.
Obviously, Jon Gruden's they're now doing a good job.
Um, my time in Cleveland was different after coming from Cincinnati on, obviously didn't turn out as well as we all like, but it was a tremendous opportunity, and we just move on and get ready for the next chance.
So talking about, you know, being a black head coach in NFL, you know, there's not, hasn't been very many of us And there aren't very many of us now in the NFL.
Is there a particular pressure? I would say with being a black head coach, because one, you know, these opportunities aren't, you know, flying open.
So when you are a head coach, do you feel pressure that, you know, I really have to do good because, you know, this could be my last chance.
Or, you know, this could look bad for, you know, us is black black men trying to be coaches.
Does that any pressure to get from that? Oh, absolutely.
I think we all carry the weight of our race.
You know, when you become a head coach in the National Football League as a minority, there's only been 18 and 100 year history, and so I've had an opportunity to do it twice, So I'm thankful for that.
But at the same time, I knew what came with it is you needed to win.
So I didn't take jobs with the thought of losing.
You take jobs with think, thought of winning of that you're gonna be putting position toe win because of the scarcity of minority coaches that get opportunities, International Football League, and sometimes it just doesn't go the way you want it to.
But do we feel that pressure? Absolutely.
So why do you also think it's hard for coordinators to get jobs? You look at Eric Man to me from the Kansas City Chiefs.
They just come out with Super Bowl and, you know, maybe he didn't want to be a head coach, But I had heard a couple of rumors that maybe he did one day, but I didn't even hear, you know, a rumor about team potentially trying to take him away from can't see.
I didn't hear anything about it, But you have guys like Judge, the coach from the Giants.
Although he's done a pretty solid job.
I think he's changing the culture around.
You know, he's never been even a coordinated before.
So what do you think? It's so hard for corn coordinators to do? We get an opportunity to be a head coach in this league.
Well, I think that's a good question.
I can't speak for Eric.
I think they're deserves an opportunity.
Obviously, being coordinator of the Kansas City Chiefs when the Super Bowl coaching a media VP.
Uh, he's checked every box you can check that way.
I just know for me, me coming up in the business, I'm a little older.
And so I watched how the National Football League moved in their hiring practices, and I knew that I had to get into the quarterback coach quarterback.
I knew if I didn't coach the quarterback, which is, you know, the most important position in the National Football League and the most important position in an organization that maybe my goal and aspiration and wouldn't come true.
So I the moving for me in my career, uh, was about really about that, about putting yourself in a position to be a coordinator, the quarterback coach, and doing those things if you wanted to be a head coach, and a lot of people don't understand that.
And when you look at minorities now, they coach about three or four different positions.
On offense is running backs and wide receivers on defense is defensive backs and maybe lying backers.
And you know that's where we get house that you know the league is 70%.
The players is 70% minority.
But in the coaching side of it is 30% minority coaches.
So you have to put yourself in position, uh, have a chance to move forward.
And I think that's what has happened because they keep moving the goal posts all the time.
Well, you need to do this.
You need to do that.
But is if you coached the quarterback and if you call place and national football, But there's not much else they can tell you that you can't do so.
That's the try each other.
Yeah, because I've noticed, you know, they'll say, Well, you can be a coordinator, but you can't be a head coach, You know? You just see that from, You know, there's been coordinators like Eric, you know, Erica Enemy.
They've done great job.
They've done really gonna He won the Super Bowl and coaching the M V P.
And my home seems to be getting better, you know, every single year this year he's, what, 27 touchdowns, one interception.
You know, it's like it's like is at some point, you know, what does he has to do to prove that I could be a head? Coaches like at least the opportunity, you know, if he fair? Well, that's a different story, but it's the fact that I need a chance to show what I can do.
But the bias it says to you that the big the issue is bigger than that.
You know, I think you bring up a great point.
But, uh, you look in the National Football League now there's only two minority coordinators.
There's only two minority quarterback, you know, there's only two minority jam.
So it's deeper than what me and you are talking about on the surface.
And until they really take a deep dive into why it's like this.
I mean, I don't see things changing.
And then after yesterday, this new rule coming out I mean, I was shocked, you know? But that's that's what they're gonna do.
They're entitled to do what they want to do.
So I mean, what do you think needs to happen? Obviously some, I mean, almost an investigation, but a deep, you know, review of this needs to be looked over, but they've been talking about have been doing this quote unquote, you know, for years.
So what do you think is the next step forward for this? To see somewhat of a change.
Well, I think in order to get change, you gotta ask the right questions, right? Right.
Go back to the start of the league.
The history of the league and people have to understand minorities wasn't even in the National Football League turn.
You know, there wasn't drafted player in the league until all of a sudden there were sanctions put up in order for to make the National Football League draft the player.
So it's deeper than what we all know, in my opinion, so But until you dive into those things and understand where the issues come from, I don't think people truly understand how to fix them.
I think we fix them.
On the surface, we do all the optic stuff, make stuff look good.
At the end of the day, nothing changed.
You know you have guys like Jim Caldwell with the coast.
I believe he went eight and eight his last year and they 99797 and they let him go.
They had a winning record.
Then they let him go.
Then they bring in the new guy.
I mean, they go with eight NATO below so It was just like, yeah, he wished he could get right.
Yeah, he wished, hoped he could save me.
And it's just kind of like What? What did he do wrong? Like, you know what? What else did you want him to do? You know, because I don't know what to say.
Well, you just said it.
That's the disappointing part when you talk about people like Jim Caldwell, who won a Super Bowl coaching Super Bowl.
Martin is one of a bowl coaching Super Bowl, and you look at both of those organizations right now.
They're not trained being up. They're trending.
You know, Detroit is that there is nothing against the organizations.
But we're talking about minority coaches who were meeting those organizations when he left talking about Jenna Call.
Well, they were nine and seven.
He was the winningest coach in the history of the organization and they got it out and they said they needed to go into another direction to take it to another level.
Well, that level has never been saying.
Marvin Lewis, after 16 years of five straight years in a row in the playoffs, is out of a job in the next year getting a job.
So that's that's got to tell you something of men of color who had a lot of success.
But don't get a get back.
So speaking of, you know, fair chances.
Your time in Oakland.
2010 when you were the O.
In 2010 and the head coach in 2011.
You guys at the O. C. In 2010.
You guys ate and ate with Jason Campbell has a quarterback.
Tom Caper was the head coach.
He leaves you take over the next year. 2011.
You awesome guys. Also go 18 8.
They let you go.
Do you think that you were given a fair shake in Oakland? No.
I mean, I'll be the first to tell you I didn't.
I thought we were just on the cuffs of really good.
You know, you go eight in Oakland.
It's time that I think the best record restraining routine.
Yeah, 31st in offense when I got there in 2010 and we went from 31st to 6 and 2010, we lose Jason Campbell, McFadden.
We lose when we lost a lot of guys and we still finished 10th on offense with Carson Palmer coming off the couch, be our quarterback.
I guarantee you, you can look through the annuals of any National Football League and you won't find it. Those that was 88.
They got fired after a circuit that doesn't.
So that was disappointing.
But I mean, again, I don't get to make the rules.
But I did understand what Mark was coming from because it was he was learning, You know, this was his dad's team and his dad totally over everything.
And so when Mark came in, there was some other advice he gotten.
He did what he felt was right.
So I respect that People have to do with the feel they have to do.
But at the same time, I wish I could have stayed there and finish what we had.
So you know, you because of your coaching, A lot of places.
One thing I've noticed about you.
You know, you haven't really been scared to do interviews.
You know, you took everything on the chin.
You know, if you underperformed here, you owned up to you know, there was no no excuses.
But I mean, obviously you're comfortable in your own skin.
But how do you, I guess block out, Like today.
I was looking on Twitter.
I was just looking up.
You know more things about what they said about you in the last 24 hours.
It's crazy how you know you haven't coaching a couple of years, but they somehow kinda bring you up.
It's just like it's like it's like bullying almost.
It's just like, Why? Why are you He has nothing to do what's going on on this situation? Why are you bringing them up? But I guess my question is, how are you able even now to take that on the chin, you know, like you never ducked from it.
I guess that's a testament to your care, because, you know, some people try to avoid things, you know, and I don't really want to talk about that.
But you owned upto, you know, your successes and some of your failures.
Yeah, you can't run from it.
I mean, at the end of the day, I hope that there's another younger minority coach who was looking at my track and the process I went through and won't be afraid to be the best version of himself.
All I could be a If people like it great.
And if they don't? I'm okay with that.
You know, they don't do.
Those people don't do much for me.
It gets frustrating, though.
I mean, because I'm human.
I'm no different anybody else, but at the same time, those things can affect you because they really don't dictate your life or dictate who you are.
So I wanna transition to a division, you know? Well, the A F C North.
It's pretty good, pretty good division this year, but, um, I have So I have a question about the four teams.
Their first, I guess starting with, um Steelers.
That's my favorite team.
How? I mean, obviously they're undefeated, But are they this good as advertised? And what? You picked them to be the favorite to come on out there A f. C. Absolutely.
And I say that for several reasons. One.
The head coach. Mike Thomas.
Yeah, Coach in season.
I mean, he's phenomenal right there.
He's a winner regards with Think he knows how to win.
The defense is the best defense in the division right now.
And so when you look at what they've done and how they want.
Even though there's a couple of games people were frustrated with last week Cowboys game or the Tennessee game did today, there ain't no we'll talk about who they beat or how they one.
When the season's over, they won the game.
So they are in the division today.
So why have they been able over the years? You know, it's fascinating how good they are.
The developing receivers, you know, they've had Mike Wallace, you know, Jews. You, Antonio Brown.
They have Deontay Johnson.
Claypool looks to be a stud.
I'm waiting for James Washington to pop, but he'll get there eventually.
But what is it that they do when they could just find a receiving? You know what? This guy right here, we're gonna make him into a star.
How are they able to do this year in the year out? It tells you that they have a profile.
They have a profile of the type of player they look for the makeup, everything.
And that's what they stick, too.
Because when I looked at the young Johnson kid, he looks so much like Antonio Brown.
He was like a around to me just what you're saying.
But they have done a really good job of finding guys who fit, uh, their particular profile, because when you look at Claypool, he's really outside of their profile.
He's a big guy, and normally they don't have big fast guys like that.
He was special, so they have out liars, and I think Clay Foods one for them.
But they've done a great job of putting talent on their team year in and year out, right? So next time is the Ravens.
Um, I've always I've never understood.
Some people say, you know, the Ravens head office in the market for former M v P.
They have talent, especially on the defensive side.
But for me always said, How good are their weapons for me? I said, Mark Andrews, he's a I would say he's a B plus tired, and I think he's legit.
They have some good running back Mark Ingram. He's aging.
That's why you go get J K. Dobbins.
But from the receiver standpoint, Marcus Brown, he's fast and small.
You have boyfriends who really hasn't popped.
You have Willie Snead.
You know, I don't know how many you know reps.
He would get on another team, you know, especially a playoff team that's supposed to be that good.
So my question is they kind of rely on Lamar to do everything.
And I feel like the one thing they're missing this year, or at least the last couple of years, is offensive weapon. They really have none.
In my opinion, well, I agree with your assessment and you look at the Baltimore Ravens.
There's still tremendous defensive football team.
The difference was last year Lamar played, you know he was the M V P M.
But what teams after they get a little tape on you Now there's two years and tape on, uh, are picking at your weakness is a little bit excited.
I mean, the fact that they brought in Dez Bryant says that they're looking for more receiver help, the one area they've struggled in.
I think the 31st and passing eso.
It's an issue and I don't think they will ever get to what they wanna be and trust me, they have a tremendous staff.
They have good players, but they have to fix this passing game in order for them to be seen as a viable Super Bowl champion.
And so until they do that, I think there will be disappointed.
Yeah, because the issue with me is, you know, this particular draft was probably the deepest wide receiver class you've seen in about a decade or so.
You know, I kind of don't feel bad for teams.
When you you have 12 receivers.
You could have drafted you just aside the draft done.
They have to Duvernay from Texas.
But, I mean, there were receivers who I had graded above him.
You know, guys like Adam Schefter.
You know, the draft guys they've had above him.
So it's when you go 123 rounds and you know you're seeing Justin Jefferson walked by.
Jalen Regular walked by his comment like, Well, I don't feel bad for you because you had an opportunity drafted and you didn't.
Alright, what? Every year it changes.
And I think what coaches have to do is look ahead.
And what I mean by that is the year before Lamar Jackson was amazing.
Force international football.
We get running it as a pastor.
He threw for so many touchdowns on.
Like I said, people will start to figure you out.
And so you gotta always stay a step ahead because here comes the next thing that's going to come at you.
And so you know his ability to run, because when you have a running quarterback, it forces teams to play single high defense, which makes it easier for the quarterback to throw the ball.
You know, playing really playing Cover one.
Now we're playing multiple coverages against the Ravens because not only are there not throwing the ball as well, but he's not running, you know, like he did the year before and scoring two touchdowns and having all the dynamic place.
He's still playing really good, but it doesn't look the same.
And I think that's what we all know it because for me, the two things I have with him, I think he's a tremendous talent is one he needs to.
I think at some point he needs to sit down with RG three to back up and say, What could you have done? What could you have done differently when you were arrested? I think the first he's gonna say I needed to slide, I think you I think he needs to teach him or have someone teach him You need to slide.
Maybe he can call the Baltimore Orioles and asked some of those guys teach him how to slide.
But he has to get down because he took a shot last week and I I thought I was surprised he didn't have a concussion.
And, you know, you're gonna have to get down.
You're you're too valuable to the franchise will be taking big hits like that from linebackers and safeties and then to I think he needs to be able to throw the ball better.
He can throw it far, but he can't throw it.
And when you have guys like marquees Brown, I don't think that Brown is being used properly.
I don't He's not as good as Tyreek Hill, but he's kind of a gadget guy.
You know, you can move him back and forth, you know, doing you know, informations and things like that.
They should in my opinion, no, who am I? But I think they should use him as a gadget guy because he's he's not as fast and as dynamic is Tyreek Hill.
But if Tyreek Hill is a 10, I think marquees bounds liken eight.
And I think that he could do similar things Right now, I don't disagree with you.
You have to find ways to showcase your talent and ability that you have on your team That's on the roster.
Uh, obviously a week ago.
Uh, you know, marquees was disappointed because he only had do attempts his way.
So this past week, you could see them trying to get him the ball more.
But at the end of the day, it was still the same as it's been.
So they're gonna have toe trend in a different direction.
Knowing John Harbaugh Guarantee he's working at it every day.
Haven't worked there, know how he thinks a little bit.
But they they're gonna figure out the best they can on how to fix it this year.
I just don't know that they can, as you said, because weapons, you know, on the team that quote unquote scares the defense is that they're eat as they move forward, right? The next team is the Bangles.
I mean, I think they drafted a stud and Joe Burrow.
People have their issues but have their concerns.
But I think he's, I think he's legit.
He's really, really good and they have weapons.
You know you have taller bowl.
Green who hasn't played that well.
But he's still a future Hall of Famer.
You have mixing, mixing the top eight top seven running back when he's healthy.
I think the biggest issue with them is defense.
But how good is Joe Burrow? And what do you think the future is? Life for? The Bengals? Is him a tremendous.
He might be the best quarterback in division, uh, played at a high level without a strong supporting cast.
He has a good aside, I agree with you the skill players from G o the mix into A J to Tyler Boy to the young Higgins kid, uh, players.
I mean, it will rival the skill players that I had when I was in Cincinnati with a J.
Green, Marvin Jones most of new high.
But at the same time, we had a big time offensive line.
What Andrew? And that's where I think they have to now invest for this player because he has the potential to be the best quarterback in this division and if he is, that he will win a lot of games.
So they're gonna have to step up, get better on the line, get better defensively, as you just mentioned in order to get the organization back to where we all know it should.
Then lastly is, uh you know, the Browns and the team.
You know very well I look around this division, Um, they have the fourth best quarterback, you know, in the division and division, where they have good defense is in two young superstar quarterback.
You can't have the fourth best quarterback in division.
You can't be four out of four.
So would you give Baker what you extended? Well, I would have toe before I answer that, I would have to be there every day.
Thio What? It is asking him, you know, because you said it.
This guy was the first pick of the draft for a reason.
And to me, they're emphasis has been running.
The football hasn't been throwing the football, so that within itself is different.
But the emphasis has been throwing the football and we've had the type of year we've had this up to this point.
No But if the emphasis has been to throw the ball, um, which I don't think it ISS, then all of a sudden we would have, ah, riel, different conversation.
But I see they're gonna have to make a real decision.
I think these last, you know, eight games are gonna tell to tell, especially get to play them because they're gonna have to make a huge decision on what to do moving for.
I think that Baker, I think he's, um he's better in the play action like you said running for they have chub, you have Hunt.
I think he's better when they run it on, maybe 1st and 2nd down and get him in the like 3rd and 4th, 3rd and 3 and they can do some play action type of stuff.
When they asked him to throw 31 32 33 times a game, I think that's when he really struggles.
I mean, he has a fantasy team of weapons, you know, their third tight end.
They drafted this year.
He won the title in award in college, you know, you know, so I think that he's better in the play action when they do less throwing, but when they get in the shootout, so I'm a little scared.
See, everybody says that.
I don't see that Baker is a better player in play act.
I think Baker is a better player when he plays the way he played as the Heisman Trophy winner.
I think you put a shotgun on, let him spray the ball all over the place.
I think that's when he's out of his best.
Obviously, the play action game does slow down the defense a little bit, but I think this guy is a Let me see it.
Let me throw it because out I thought he was one of the most accurate.
Yeah, what I've seen and I I think he has a tremendously strong on.
I don't know what throw that he can't make.
So it goes back again to putting people on the right system to showcase their talent ability.
And I think that's what they're dealing with right now.
Yeah, I mean, when he came out, I went to Texas Tech.
So, you know, I got toe see him terrorize us, you know, for years, unfortunately, but yeah, I saw I was at the baker in the homes game they both, you know, through for 1000 years I was I was there, so I got to see firsthand.
You know how good Baker made for it is, but it's like the further he gets away from more you.
He comes in the pros.
There's no super precise, accurate quarterback, but now is, you know, sometimes he gets a little loose with the ball.
You know, it's you have Jarvis Land.
You have, um, O B J.
It's kind of like, Well, he can't get them the ball.
So it's kind of it's when he gets into the shoot that he's just not throwing about accurate enough, right? And you said it.
I mean, you just said something.
You said what he was in college, you know? Then he comes in football.
They get is different.
You know, to me the big message.
I've been trying to get to everybody when it comes to quarterbacks, when it comes to coaches, when it comes to every anything, if you don't give a player or coach what they're used to in order for them to get their own winds, their personal wins you can just believe it's not gonna go a well, you know.
I think he's in that struggle right now because there are running team, but they're five and three as a running team.
But that might not be the best fit for Baker. Mayfield.
You know, that's what they've got to figure out if they move forward.
So your time in Cleveland there, You know, what do you think went wrong in Cleveland? Was it the culture? Because, you know, even, you know, before you got there, they weren't.
You know, they weren't lighting the world on fire with winds, and they were They've been struggling for a while now.
So what do you think went wrong? Was it the culture? Was that, you know, a combination of things? I think it was a combination of a lot of things, and I'm not gonna really just dive totally into it, right? In order for, uh, teams toe win for organizations to win, you have to see things the same way you know it.
But the coach wants to win one way, and the G M wants to win another way.
And ownership Probably not gonna work, you know.
You hire a coach because you're taking his vision and you wanna do it the way that he sees fit.
And I think that's the most important thing.
I would say that any coach who's going to take a head coaching job, just make sure that everybody's on the same page.
About what? How we gonna win, What is going to take the win? Because if you don't, you know you're pulling in different directions and it's hard enough to win in the National Football League.
So alignment the right way.
It just doesn't so going into the 2018 draft, you know, Baker was the number one people like we discussed.
But were there any guys you guys work may be considering at the top? You know Barkley was there, Sam Donald also was, You know, the second quarter of taking on the board was anyone else you guys were considering And what made you guys pick Baker? Oh, absolutely.
I mean, I think all the guys that you just mentioned what I said, but I think we felt that Baker had the characteristics that make up everything We were looking for the handle, the pressure of playing quarterback in Cleveland and being successful, I mean, the whole thing.
The album put them in position to be successful.
We weren't gonna starting right away because we had Tyrod Taylor Tyrod down and came baker.
And everybody asked him, Why didn't you play him right away if he was good as he's been advertised? Well, because we don't know, the left tackle Joe Thomas have retired.
So you're not gonna take the franchise future sticking in there? We're not sure they'll attack Awas.
We made a decision, and obviously, I think we made the right decision.
We played Tyrod Baker was had to go in there, and obviously he did a great job.
Had a heck of a year. 2018.
So I want to offer Get down here.
I know what you saw.
What happened on, uh, what was that? Sunday night when, um, the saints just select the Tampa Bay Buccaneers.
Um, so you you know, you were there in Cincinnati when you had, um, shadows.
Well, Chad Johnson at the time, then and then get t.
How hard was it? Wasn't hard, You know, to have two dynamic receiver with two different person eyes.
You know, Chad is very, um, flamboyant.
You know, he's very, you know, he's a superstar, you know.
That's how far receivers are and TJ's.
He's a He was a big time as well, but I think he was a little more calm.
How that much com T. J.
Was good, his chat or better.
So it was tough, but at the same time, they respected each other.
Way felt in order for us to be a good offense.
Both of those guys had to touch the football what we believed.
I mean, we believed at that time in spreading the ball around, making sure I mean chat left the game with six catches for 80 9400 plus yards and we got good think they with T J.
So they understood each other.
But the most important thing about those two guys they wanted to win, and that was more important than any.
So how do you think this? You know, Carousel could be with the Buccaneers, and they have Mike Evans.
I think he's what a top five receiver in NFL, you have Chris Godwin.
I think he's If he's not in the top 10, he's probably 11 do you have Antonio Brown, the future Hall of Famer? Despite, you know, the off the field issues he's he'll be a Hall of Fame released.
He should be as the stats to be.
Um, how do you think that carousel is going to be? Because you know Mike Evans? He hasn't really said, but he looks a little to me, a little frustrated, you know? He's big time.
How do you think that carousel could be? And you know how.
How would it be for the management? I think it z manageable in my in my mind, in my opinion, obviously, you have to get Mike Evans the ball.
Yeah, Chris, Good with the ball.
This was his search game, and you said it.
I mean, he's his from a player standpoint, he's been better than both of those guys.
But we don't just got football in a long time, so we'll find out about who he is as well.
Ugo And one thing I've learned, uh, talents tax itself the most.
How the players, they kinda it will show itself.
Everybody else falls in line.
Their struggles, in my mind are bigger than just their receivers I mean, their struggle the other night was protection, uh, in orderto be able to hold the ball for a time to be able to get into the receiver.
So it's got to start with that first.
That stuff all has to go hand in hand.
Receivers gotta be at the right spot, but protection has to be paramount because you have to give up ground grudgingly, especially when you have that move around.
I mean, even for me, you know, the offense had their struggle, but I think also was I think it was both in the defense. They did.
They didn't play well either.
You know, the books got the ball for or they go three and now ST walking down the field.
They get it back often. Doesn't score again. I was 14.
Then it goes to 21.
You know you're three, you're down 21.
I'm the same defense. Well, you know, they're not running it anymore.
I could just drop back and playing coverage because you're not running it anymore, Then I think Brady, you know, you have a big physical receiver like Mike Evans.
It's just kinda just because, you know, I don't know what Brady had.
I don't think he's missing arm time, arm strength per se, but he's a big physical receive.
I would like to see him challenge him or down the film.
It is tough in martial Latimores across the field.
He's he's really, really good.
But I think that I would like to him take more shots towards of right now and I agree with everything you're saying.
I mean, I don't like I said, It's hard, we're not there.
But when you want game, you watch New Orleans game plan play out the way they thought it should be.
A bucks from game plan play out the way they did not want to play eight Russia's.
You know that's not what they want to do, and that's not what I don't think any team would wanna do.
They got behind very quickly as you mentioned, and then all of a sudden you're playing catch up.
These teams know that you need to throw the ball in order to score points.
You run the wind, you throw the score, you know never gets that and so they pin their ears back and they played New Orleans football and obviously on their side of the ball.
Drew Brees played really well.
No turnovers, three touchdowns, and then you have been three interceptions.
So e mean it was It was just the worst nightmare for the bucks on what could thing.
But you better believe everybody's gonna try that particular defense in order down from here on it.
I think the big story for me after that game was yeah, the the books they got, you know, they got rolled.
But the biggest story for me was You're a wild card team now.
So now when you know the playoffs start, you're gonna have to go Likely to Philly, You know, on the road, you can be feeling they have a bunch of injuries, unfortunately, but so you can beat them.
But you're probably gonna have to go to New Orleans and you're probably gonna have to go going to go to Seattle or you go to the Packers.
I don't like the chances I don't and I understand that.
I mean, obviously it's still early.
There's eight games.
Get on another role.
They can figure out this issue that they haven't and fix it because the answer's air there is not anybody.
Come in and and fix this.
The players, the coaching staff, they gotta get this fixed and they can.
They guys what? They won five in a row or whatever so they can get back on the road.
But you said it.
They gotta get it fixed because they're going to see some of the similar things that they've seen the other night.
And that's the way people don't try to expose it.
So I want to talk to you about, you know, fit in this league.
How important is fit, you know, And if I think it's very important, you know, you could be like Sam Donald super talent.
But you go to the Jets, you know, offensive line.
This week, they trade pretty much every good defensive player on the team.
Coaching with Adam Gates is a little suspect, or you could be like my homes.
You could go to the Kansas City, where you can see the year play behind a pretty good quarterback and, um, probably pretty good quarterback and Alex Smith.
You get Andy Reid, one of the best offensive minds in the league and you have weapons galore.
Kelsey Carrick Hill.
You know, you just get anything.
You can actually have a good offensive line.
How important is fit in this league? It's so important.
I don't think people talk about it enough.
I appreciate you saying that because talent doesn't fit everywhere, and that's what I think.
People think you could just go put this guy on the team, but people don't understand.
Some coaches are not flexible enough to go do what that player does.
This is the same thing we're talking about, whether it's Baker, Mayfield or Joe Burrow.
Why is your borough playing so well? Well, they're letting him do what he does well, They get information saying, Joe, you figure it out because you're so active with the ball girl.
Okay? And so he's having huge success.
That right there should tell people why people have success and why people don't so challenges doesn't fit everywhere.
It's got it all worked together for the player, the players that are around him, the coaching staff and what they're trying to accomplish.
That's how you make players really special in the National Football League, as you just mentioned about Patrick? No.
Right, because I think you know Pat.
I mean, he's a tremendous talent.
I mean, I got to see him firsthand.
I got I went toe one of his workouts.
No stretching, no warm up.
He threw it 70 yards from his knees.
So when I seen that, I was like, Okay, well, you know, this guy's arm is clearly been kissed by God, but he he was flatfooted, standing at the goal line with just a torque of his hips.
Yeah, it's just it's just crazy the type of, you know, I'm kindly has.
But I could see it also doesn't hurt.
You know, I'm not gonna knock him, but it doesn't hurt when you get Andy Reid.
You know, that is a big, big plus.
Not everybody gets that.
You know, some people they wish they could come into that said I know Sam Darling.
He'll never admit it, but he's probably under his red pocket.
You know, if I had Andy Reid, I could do something similar to that.
What every Batman needs.
Robin Wright regards a real good quarterbacks have great receivers.
People just look, you know, they have good receivers and then they have good play calls.
It is no different in the National Football League.
Different basketball, baseball.
It just all works together.
It has to fit in order to have the success that you're looking for, right? So speaking about, you know, the Cowboys, they have their issues are not playing well, that I want to talk about their division, I guess.
Basically, between the Eagles and Carson Wentz, Um, I'm a big fan of Carson was.
I don't he hasn't played that good DJ has.
I think he's turned the ball more as an individual than 30 of the NFL teams on the 32 of.
He's turned the ball more than 30 of them.
But, I mean, he's missing.
So Jackson has played two games.
He got hurt in both.
Jeffrey hasn't played.
Reagor missed almost half the season.
Goddard just came back.
He's missing three of his All Pro or Pro Bowl.
Lyman Mile Sanders is hurt.
Um, the other there back of other running back was hard as well.
Am I crazy or there's not a lot of quarterbacks that would do well when you're missing all that? No I think you're absolutely right.
But because he's been paid and he's seen his one, it's in the league.
The narrative is he should be performing at a higher level.
People getting at these guys, they're human.
And at the end of the day, he's trying to make plays for his team because he knows if he doesn't, nobody else is going to so and you understand and it it would take people who are in the National Football League to really understand what he's going through.
But when you don't have your weapons and you don't have great protection and you're kind of stuck out there by yourself, it could get very, very tough out there.
I think hopefully they'll get some guys back and he'll start to play better because they're one of those sleeper teams.
In my opinion, they could there, on here at the end.
Up here comes the Philadelphia Eagles in the NFC championship, because with me, you know, even look at their receivers.
He went to Houston, he played quarterback.
He was, ah, Heisman candidate.
You know, he's turned into a pretty solid receiver, but I mean, you know, goodness, he was a quarterback in college.
Travis Fulgham, Undrafted Old Dominion.
Mean the Packers.
We always, you know, talk about how they need receivers. He was a Packer.
So it's like then you have.
Then you just get regular back.
So he's not, You know, he's playing with, you know, they're still pros.
Obviously, there's not nowhere near what he was looking for to come. No comeback.
E don't understand.
When those guys were out and they come back.
You still don't have that chemistry, right? Exactly.
Practice with them a lot.
Yeah, you're working on the game plan and you're working on game plan plays.
But there's still that feeling, the chemistry of knowing a guys body language, how he he wants the ball when he anticipates the ball.
All that stuff goes into, then I guess, another team in the division on the Cowboys.
Unfortunately, you know, Dax heard he's gonna miss the rest of the year.
But what do you think? What do you think they should do? You know, going forward, dummy.
So I think they should extend deck.
I think with him being hurt pretty much showed how valuable he is.
I think he's showing that, you know? Well, we thought they could kind of trade water with dog.
You know, then you have Cooper rush out there and Gary Gilbert, but I think that the trade deadline is over now.
I thought they still tried to get off of them.
One of those receivers, I would've probably said tomorrow.
I mean, he's a tremendous in one on one.
I think they probably could have got him.
Maybe got to tools for maybe a mid to late first round pick and just stack the deck when, um, that comes back.
They didn't make their decision, though, right? I think they feel like they're that the deck is stacked with that quarterback.
You know, they got three really good receivers.
You know, you're talking about the young kids from Oklahoma and you just mentioned Amari Cooper and they have some tight ends and you're talking about Ezekiel Elliott when they get their quarterback back.
I think they gotta feel very comfortable offensive about what they're doing and working.
There's no question they should extend them.
I mean, he has known prior to even getting hurt that he is the heartbeat of that football team as a quarterback.
He wanted a better quarterbacks in the league, and then they need to go get them some defensive help.
Yeah, I mean, they cut, you know, they got rid of poll.
They said he was a little overweight.
Vander Rash comes back from an injury.
He's played okay, They lose digs.
He's gonna probably missed 4 to 6 weeks.
I think they do.
Todo do some major major improvements on the defense is I don't know what they need to do.
But I think that even with Cooper, though, I think Cedric Wilson he's not as good as cool.
But I think he's still really good.
What's really interesting again? You make so many great points and that's what I hope.
The fans really understand that when I keep saying the team has to be ready for the quarterback like Dak, Dak is one of the better players in this league.
But the team was losing so people.
Why do you wanna play that? Well, it was the defense play on defense, so part of getting ready for a deep for a quarterback is you need to be good.
No, no question you need to be good at what he does.
But you also got baby slow people down to get him the ball more.
Let's talk about your borough.
I mean your borough.
I think it's it's unbelievable quarterback.
And now I mean, people were talking because it is the first year, but you let him keep a defense like he's had for the last several for the last several games.
I mean, for the fine, like he said, and people start saying he can't play, you know, that's just that goes hand in hand.
So you have to get ready for the quarterback when you have a special one that's on your team so that he can be who he can be.
I think that's so important.
And I think of a decade.
I was trying to tell, you know, cowboy fans, and you probably know it's better to be how they could get.
He can't He shouldn't expect him to score 40 plus and have to win.
Like at some point, something has to give absolutely and and and it should have to get.
I mean, that's why you played executive Elliott.
You know that the Dallas Cowboys was a running football team when this all started and he's grown back, has grown.
And so all they become this dynamic offense, which I think is great.
But at the same time, how do you win is a football team, you know? Do we run? I'm very good because we don't put our defense out.
There is many times.
All that stuff has to be thought through in order for change and organization to win, right? I guess another team.
I want to talk about some things.
The Packers. I mean, they're leaving, they're leaving their division.
Um, I think they're gonna win the division.
But they kinda remind me how they were last year.
There really, really pretty when things are going well.
But I think when they play a team that's just there could be more physical them.
I think there not, as I think, they're a little soft.
I think they kind of get pushed around a little bit sometimes, especially when you get in the trenches.
They looked a little a little softer when they played teams like last.
They played the 40 Niners, they get rolled.
When you play, you know those tougher teams.
I think they kind of take a step back.
What do you think? Well, I think they like you, said they Probably because they've got a big enough lead in their division.
Yeah, but don't be surprised in Minnesota.
Don't come screaming up here later.
I just I know Mike Zimmer work with friends.
Obviously he beat the pack.
Dalvin Cook is have enough sensational season.
We're going to run the football first.
They have playmakers on the outside with Jefferson dealing and young tight end.
You know, the kid from Alabama, They're going to be a problem here over the next several weeks because I kept getting their groove.
I think Zim has figured out because he let a lot of players go off the team.
I think these guys are now starting to get their groove, and so they're starting to play Well, well, we think the Packers have played extremely well early and then they've had a couple of teacups here and there.
But they still got Aaron Rodgers.
They still got Adams.
You know, they they're a good team, but it's gonna be interesting down the stretch. How this all unfolds.
Do you think that the young corners.
They'll be able to get, you know, come along with their younger bunch of rookies and second year guys and you think they're gonna be ableto, you know, come up department.
They're almost not rookies anymore.
I think that you played 10, 11, 12 games. You're a rookie anymore.
So I think for the for the U.
Oh, no, that that's that's what I think has been the issue.
Those young players air now, like you said in rookies anymore.
You know, they've got their feet wet early and they were getting their butts kicked.
So they they're learning how to play.
And I guarantee you, that's where Mike Zimmer spending a lot of his time.
I know him too well.
And he's not gonna go for that ball going over his head a lot.
E guess the birthing when there is other bears.
Um, I thought, you know Mag Maggi coming in.
I thought he wanted to be in a better younger, younger, offensive minded coaches.
But sometimes when I watch him coach, you know, like I said, who am I? But I feel that some of the play calling the scheme, especially how they used David Montgomery.
It just really frustrates me.
I'm the one of the biggest David Montgomery friends.
I also unfortunately got to see him terrorized my Texas Tech Raiders when he was at Iowa State.
But I see they get down this 31.
They're, you know, they're doing runs out of the shotgun like get in, I information, get that full back right there and let him.
He's David, man.
I think they, instead of running out of shotgun all the time, it's super predictable.
Just getting the information main and just get hand the ball off, let him get the first down, right? Sometimes just got lined up and watch the other team in the face.
E agree with it.
And you said what? Their issues.
They're really good on defense.
They got to go find out they have to find offense because if they do, they will be a problem in that division as well.
But right now they can't score enough, you know, in order to put enough pressure on these other teams in order to win.
Right? Um, I guess I got a few more questions here.
Get back to the A F.
C Um, the A F C East.
You know, you look at Miami, they get a good coaching there and Brian Floor is there today.
They are a playoff team.
Talk about, you know, I think the Texas and as a team they're gonna individually make them really good.
But talk about, you know, Brian forcing the job he's done with Miami.
I think the job that Bryan Flores has done, it's amazing.
And I think he had a plan.
I think him and Chris Beard GM, they work plan on people.
I kept telling people they're gonna be the most improved team of my pain if you go look at him.
Last year they came on strong at the end.
They didn't start.
Well, you're out there playing great football, you know, And so and for them to go down to the Cardinals to win that game against Kyler Murray and the first you know, the best offense and football here.
Now that tells you something.
And next year, all these new draft picks they're gonna be putting on the team too.
There. Are there gonna be loaded it.
So you said that because when I go back and I think about the Super Bowl, people forget when the Patriots beat the Rams.
People forget who the coordinator.
Well, everybody was talking about the Belichick.
It was, uh, well, there was the one that was calling that defense a game that slowed down the fastest guys on turf or whatever they wanted to call him at that time.
So Brian Florida's, knows how coach he knows what he needs to do, and he's demonstrated that he's doing a fantastic job.
And for me, you know, for him, toe, I guess the, you know, the Stones toe take out.
You know, the quarterback and Fitzpatrick and start tour to see what he has.
And he put a little He played OK against the Ram, but they still want regardless.
But he comes out with the shootout with Colin Murray, and he looks like the guy everyone had, you know, tanking for tour.
He looked like that guy.
People don't get I mean, everybody said why didn't claim early.
Why is he you know the big question? Why is he making this decision now? When 33 I will take people back.
You have to make sure your team is ready.
He wanted to make sure there was an offensive line for this guy, that dealers were ready, that the defense was gonna be ready for this player to be put out there so that he can go get his wins and get his value.
He won against the Rams at home.
He just traveled on the war on the road and just be travels.
He's too, And Oh, so that is a great decision.
I think that I think they might be What? A receiver? Maybe another running back away from really, really popping.
They have a good defense, a bunch of young guys on defense as well.
The offense is pretty young, and they have picks.
Gloria, I want to see what this, um, Texas pick turns out to be.
They keep playing the way they're playing.
You could see potentially, maybe a Jamal Chase type of God, um, in the dolphin's uniform next year. Absolutely. No doubt.
That would be terrible for that division, because yeah, for sure.
Obviously, the bills were playing good, but because of all the graphic all all the assets that they have over the next year, they got a chance to really make a huge difference.
Then that's a team that is the patriot.
You know, a lot of people were, you know, speaking on the brilliance of Bill Belichick, you know? Well, Bill's gonna go 10 and 6, 11 and five years strictly off of his brilliance.
Well, today, there what? Three and five.
And he almost lost of the Jets on Monday night.
E think that the Patriots? Their what? The slowest offensive team in the league? I don't think is even close.
Um, what is it with Bill and not being able to draft? Um, offensive skill position players? No, he hasn't drafted a good when, I guess since drunk he hadn't had to.
I mean, when you have the quarterback, as I said, you know, Batman and Robin, I mean, that was guys work well together, and I think people don't get the check.
Was very honest here just recently last week when he said, Look, we sold out.
We sold out four Super Bowls.
We won three Super Bowls in that time, every coach of the National Football League would like to say that.
You know, everybody would like to say that, and so they won three Super Bowls in that time.
And now people are talking about what? What's wrong with Bill? There ain't nothing wrong with Bill.
You don't have time just because when I'm was there, they still didn't have very good skill guys other than Randy Moss.
At some point in time, they take these guys because you look at their profile love, slot guys and receiver.
That's who they play with.
Those guys always like elderman and they play like that.
You look up and you go, man, why can't they get a better receiver? Well, that's that's That's what it's been the Patriot way.
Now they may have to change because Brady's anymore, right? I mean, then, you know you have with 4 to 6, opt out, especially on defense, is tough.
Absolutely, and that's the other thing.
I think that that hurt them.
Those guys did opt out some really good players that were starters that would have made a difference to their team and so I think people have to understand that it doesn't seem like people want to give him the benefit of the doubt.
But trust me, he is the best coach in the National Football League. Barna.
Yeah, I think, Um, I think I think he's the best one as well.
It's just It's just kind of weird to see them struggling about me when you lose arguably the greatest player of all time and Brady, you know, get you know, one year you have in the next year you don't.
I mean, things were bound toe, you know, go sideways.
Absolutely. I think you said it, though.
I mean, there's no Brady.
You take all those other defensive players out.
I mean, what do you think I don't have, right? You're not gonna be, you know, at this 0.8. No.
You know, like you just said to be three and five, you know? So I think people have to understand that.
What do you think about Cam? You know, so far, I mean, I think with him in the beginning to, you know, he was rolling.
He was playing, you know, pretty well.
I mean, he had unfortunately got covert, and that does take a tremendous toll on your body.
Were still learning about this virus, you know, as we go.
But do you think that he's gonna be able to play himself to maybe not an extension with the Patriots? Or maybe for a different team? I hope you can.
I mean, when you look at Teddy Bridgewater and what he's doing Panthers, I mean, which has been phenomenal.
I think you said it, I think can start off like a house of fire, then coat it.
And he hadn't looked the same, you know, and none of us know the effects of Cove it and what it does to you.
Nobody knows, effective when a guy's out and you're not practicing anymore, they didn't team what the effects are.
So I think we all have to cut him a little slack to and hopefully here down the stretch.
He could go back to being the camp that we've seen earlier in the year, and, uh, well, obviously he will That team toe win the other night.
But there were some throws even in that game that I'm sure he would have liked to have back because he can make those throws.
He's demonstrated that he can, so he just got to continue to work at it, continue to get better, and and hopefully things will work out for him.
Here again, you got, like, maybe 34 more questions.
You know what? Eight going and everything. Week nine.
Who are the best? You know, I guess four teams you think you've seen so far.
Who do you think you maybe you could see the Super Bowl.
Or maybe the matchup the four teams that I that I've picked today.
One you have toe get it to the Pittsburgh Steelers There. Eight.
I think they've demonstrated that they're going to be there in the end.
Yeah, but the team that's right behind him know how to do it. Katz, City Chiefs.
They've been there, wanted.
The quarterback is special on day, have special playmakers, and they just have a special field to him.
And as soon as they get Levian Bell going, it's gonna be different.
You know, I truly believe that the other team eyes the Buffalo Bills.
I mean, we are talking about the bills.
I think they ratchet it up a little bit defensively.
I don't think they played well defensively, Josh Allen, when they let Josh Allen do what he does.
I think they play extremely well.
I thought two weeks ago they start trying to run him out in, you know, mixed down runs and he could run with the football.
But I think he's a scoring zone running quarter.
He's going first plays, but he can throw it and he's demonstrated himself.
Eso is gonna be interesting, and then my fourth team is.
It's a toss up between two teams one day in the New Orleans Saints.
E think they're on their way back in the Baltimore Ravens.
You know, I think Baltimore can get their issues.
You know we'll all be excited, but they can't Obviously, I think New Orleans is gonna keep trending up now that Michael Thomas is back.
The better defensive.
So, no, I noticed that.
You didn't say the Seahawks.
I know they did just get me the Bills.
Just just throttle them the other day or on Sunday.
What do you think your issues are? Or the pushback from the Seahawks? It's hard for me not to say the Seahawks could speak.
Carol is the University of Pacific graduate, just like I am, but I can see defensively that there's some issues, you know, uh, Seahawks defense have never had 40 something points scored on him like the other day, And they have all year from that standpoint.
And Russell Wilson has, you know, had been the mid season M v p, you know, put him up.
But now he started throwing interceptions.
People know they get ahead, they're gonna force Seattle the throw.
That's a whole different game.
And so it's, uh, they gotta I don't I don't know how they're gonna fix that this year on the back end, and people are now destroying Covered three, you light up display cover three.
All the time you did destroy with me is interesting there, one of those teams I always tell my friends about.
They have good defensive players, but not a good defense like you have Jamal Adam.
He's an All Pro Bobby Wagner.
He's a future Hall of Famer.
You have snacks.
Harrison, who they just signed, and Carlos Dunlap there really good.
But collectively, as a unit, they're not that good. I found it interesting.
You know, Jamaar Adams comes back and then they get to get 40 ft on it was just interesting.
E a lot of that.
If you go look at that system, the system plays basically one or two coverages.
They don't play multiple public.
And I say that because that's the same issue that's going down at the charges, in my opinion, one man's opinion, because those guys come out of that same system.
But you gonna look at Raheem Morris at Atlanta? Wait a minute.
We gotta play more than just cover three.
So they're playing some two d.
They're playing some quarters.
And so it slowed some teams down and scoring.
And you see Atlanta's and winning games, and she needs other teams losing it.
So this year's rookie quarterbacks, you have to a Borough Herbert next 10 years.
You haven't played a full season yet, and two is only play with two games.
But if you were guessing, let's say five years, what do you what do you think that the order would be between those three her bro since the Herbert's study.
He's really good. Thio.
Why? Why is Herbert, 30? I think Herbert he's a stud.
I think he is, too.
I think I think too, who has some special schools football, and I think it's starting to show itself.
I can see both of those guys have been to and to a as we go.
But I think bird those different.
I just do I think, is different.
I think he's good.
I think Hager's is.
I think everybody is excited because it's not what people anticipated.
People didn't think he would be e Football League and throw for 307 yards every week, but I will say this.
He has one of the best quarterback coaches and all the pro football in Pep.
Hamilton and Pep is doing a great job with this guy.
And so Pep knows how to get these guys ready to play.
Haven't had, um, you know, Andrew Luck and I think that's doing that.
An outstanding job.
E think with Tour.
He has just don't know how to explain that he has something about him that just galvanize people like together because you even see when he when he's in the huddle, they just like the whole team.
They have, like a certain, you know, pop or a certain juice about.
I don't know how to explain what it is, But it's just, I think, it just his personality.
When you see him, you know you wanna be around.
It's his personality.
When you heard the comment he made about Aaron, Donald being on satellite talked to me.
We talk guys like that. You know, players.
Players kind of gravitate to that.
And I think the other thing about two, he's a winner.
He can't remember a lot of games.
So people and expect he's going to come in this on this team and he's gonna help us win.
And that's what he's doing because But I don't understand what you know Game week or the week he plays against the Rams.
He wins, and everyone's like, uh, two.
I don't I don't see the you know.
I don't see what was so special about him, But then, now it's crazy how things change from, you know a week Now he beats the Cardinals and, oh, why don't we draft to one? You know, it's just it's so interesting to me that how you guys were this way because I was telling people he played one game and he won like like calm down.
Hey, you back to what we were talking about earlier, about teams being ready and change up on defense.
So they beat the ranch.
Yes, the Rams, who were playing extremely well.
Donald knocks the ball out of his hand.
He throws her 90 yards and a touchdown.
Everybody goes mad.
What they're talking about.
Two. They won the game.
Coach knew that.
So the next week he comes in.
He completes like 20 of 28 you know, for 200 some yards and two touchdowns and makes a run that almost look like Holler Murray.
But not as fast. It's got a Murray in the game.
Wow, this guy's the greatest thing since apple sauce.
So that's the thing you wanna happen.
These young quarterbacks, you gotta make sure values high because they need to get their own personal wins in order for those that feel good about what they're doing.
Yeah, he did. He did. He did that with no gasket.
You know, that's their best running back.
And he didn't even play. Absolutely.
So, um, this is made him getting getting to the end of it.
Um, you know what's next for you, which you consider coming back to coaching.
I plan on coming back to coaching next year.
Plan coach in the National Football League somewhere.
And if not, it has to be in the college ranks.
So I'll go do that, too.
But I do plan on coaching again.
Yeah, we were We would love to have you and and love it.
I don't know. They don't know. They don't call on your phone.
But, you know, we could we could win Kirby.
You know, we would love to have a huge Jackson in love, but I would like to see I'll come back to the games, but, um, I guess the last question I want to actually talk about, you know, the Hue Jackson Foundation I see that, you know, created a task force on the foundations, um, help in human trafficking.
I think that's, you know, a beautiful cause to dedicate to talk about that foundation and why you did it, Hugh Jackson dot Or give People are interested.
We're trying to impact human trafficking.
We partner with the Salvation Army.
We have a residence there in their facility that houses human trafficking victims.
We're doing everything we can tow make an impact that way.
We think it's, uh um, you know, it is It's an issue, and it's everywhere.
And I think we're trying to do a better job of getting the information out so people can truly understand what human trafficking is so that they can make a difference.
But obviously, in order to do these things, that takes money.
So we're doing everything we can to keep the facility open and run.
Well, I wanna, you know, thank you for coming on.
My show was a lot of fun. I learned a lot.
Definitely for sure.
And I wish you the best with your coaching career.
I'm sure you'll be back on the sideline very soon.
Thank you very much.
I appreciate that.
Take care of that.
Thank you, sir. Have a good rest of your day. This is a man.