SportsCastr - One Giant Podcast - Ohio State Buckeye Prospects with Jay Stephens
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Podcast

One Giant Podcast

with Adam Armbrecht & Andy Mackiewicz

Adam Armbrecht@OneGiantPodcast

“One Giant Podcast” is a SportsCastr Featured Podcast all about the 4-time Super Bowl champion New York football Giants. Your hosts, Adam Armbrecht and Andy Mackiewicz balance the emotional roller coaster that is being a fan of Big Blue with cold hard numbers and analytics to give any Giants fan an expert’s perspective on their team.

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Description

Jay Stephens from Locked On Buckeyes Podcast joins Adam and Andy to break down all the prospects coming to the draft next month. They guys chop it up over Wyatt Davis, Shaun Wade, Josh Myers, Justin Hilliard(Jay's sneaky value pick), Trey Sermon and even Tuf Borland!

Adam also brings up Just Fields and his "falling stock" as well as asking Jay what impact COVID-19 specifically had on these prospects.

Transcript

00:00:00
Welcome to the one giant podcast.
00:00:04
A SportsCastr featured podcast covering all things.
00:00:07
New York football giants live every Monday, Wednesday and Friday morning on SportsCastr, bringing balance to the ****ytics and emotions of covering Big Blue.
00:00:17
Here are your hosts Adam Arm Bread and Andy Mega Wicks.
00:00:22
Yes, yeah, and, as always, friends this time on a Friday in the mid day slot switched it up a little bit.
00:00:30
So one giant podcast where, as always I'm Adam, are back, joined by the healthy, the wealthy and wise Andy MCA wits and then a special guest, Right? Andy? Absolutely.
00:00:39
I am very excited because our guests today follows a team in college that is near and dear to my heart.
00:00:47
I spent two years covering clients in the great city of Columbus, Ohio.
00:00:52
I spent many late nights entertaining clients in the short north, right next to Ohio State campus.
00:01:00
So I am really excited about our guest today, and that is, of course, one J. Stevens.
00:01:05
He is a little crossover from my locked on network status.
00:01:09
He covers the Buckeyes for lockdown Buckeyes, as you would assume, but, Jay, you're also doing your own podcast as well right.
00:01:15
Let everybody know just just who you are, What you're covering.
00:01:18
That is correct.
00:01:19
Guys happen to be here with you.
00:01:20
I am the host of Locked on Buckeyes.
00:01:22
Happen to where? The Ohio State hat to represent the team that I do cover for the lockdown podcast network.
00:01:28
And then also, I do host the J.
00:01:30
Stevens podcast for Almost Forgot the name of my very own podcast with my name in the title.
00:01:35
Um, that drops every Monday and Thursday.
00:01:37
And also, you can hear me every Monday on Locked on Big 10 myself and Ben Stevens.
00:01:42
We call it the Stevens and Stephen Show.
00:01:44
We have fun recapping the weekend in victim sports.
00:01:48
I love it, man.
00:01:49
And I got on there and talked a little bit on the J.
00:01:51
Stevens podcast talking about the Brooklyn Nets, obviously.
00:01:53
And it was just a great conversation.
00:01:54
So, as I said to Andy before we got started, this is the easy one.
00:01:58
This is where Jake comes in and does all the heavy lifting now, uh, you know, free agency kind of hit here.
00:02:03
Big splashes for the New York football giants, Obviously, Kenny Golladay.
00:02:07
They also bring in Adoree Jackson.
00:02:08
So all of a sudden, Giants fans start to get the sense of Maybe we're kind of going all in here.
00:02:13
This could be, you know, we're trying to actually make a statement in the upcoming season.
00:02:16
So as March winds down and we start to get into April and the draft, we really start to look at what could be potential fits for the New York football giants.
00:02:25
And there's a handful of guys here that we want to get into.
00:02:29
Not so much in the first round.
00:02:30
I would say, because there's one particular player, we might as well touch on them.
00:02:33
Right? Justin Fields Not necessarily going to be a target for the New York football Giants quickly on him before we get into some team specific prospects, what's happened here with him in terms of his draft stock, because it seems like he's the guy that is going to be the, you know, the proverbial quote, falling star in the draft, someone Maybe he's gonna get a steal as he tumbles out of the top 10.
00:02:54
What's happened with him from a prospect standpoint, cause there was a time when he was the quarter overall.
00:03:00
The Jets, we're gonna take him, don't worry about it.
00:03:02
And that very quickly helpful.
00:03:04
I think it's just a factor of people watching too much film and trying to outsmart themselves.
00:03:09
Um, happens all the time.
00:03:10
This time of year, there's always that one quarterback or that one player, the ****ysts say.
00:03:14
Oh, well, he has X, y and Z wrong.
00:03:16
Well, let's just stop and think about what you're talking about from the playing career of Justin Fields.
00:03:22
Basically quote unquote.
00:03:23
He played a year and a half of starting football in college football.
00:03:27
He had the one full year, basically a half year this year, a year and a half of a starting starting quarterback.
00:03:33
It really only had two really bad games.
00:03:36
So if you think about all of that and what you're listening and listening to on T V and be a podcast that are out there, people, I think they're outsmarting themselves and trying to trying to act like they're smart, like people are smart.
00:03:48
Look at me wrong, but you watch all the tape, watch extra tape and you talk about the Indiana game.
00:03:53
You talk about the Northwestern game, Nobody is going to bring up the Alabama game because one guy we might talk about today got hurt earlier in that game, and that changed the entire landscape of Ohio State's offense during that game.
00:04:06
So if you have a year and a half of college football starting and you're only going to highlight and say he had two bad games and now you're saying he's falling from QB to to maybe QB five Is it his play or is it you trying to outsmart yourself? I'm getting warmed up.
00:04:20
Guys, I didn't know that was gonna come out early in the show, but, um, the Justin Fields slander has kind of irritated me because a lot of it makes no sense.
00:04:29
Well, on this show, we certainly do like Justin Fields.
00:04:32
I think just just from a fit in any perspective, things have gone horribly wrong.
00:04:36
If somehow the Giants are taking Justin Fields at 11 for Daniel Jones, you know that that would be the red flag for us.
00:04:42
But I do hope he comes off the board earlier.
00:04:45
I think he's a tremendous prospect, You know, when we think about someone that maybe on the fringe of the first round, Uh, someone that's probably near and dear to the Giants, you know, specifically for a need is someone like Wyatt Davis.
00:04:56
Um, you know, Jay, can you talk to us a little bit about his draft potential where you see him going? And you know, if the Giants do end up being able to select him, what type of player they be getting? 6.
00:05:07
4 £310.
00:05:09
A lot of ****ysts, or having left sided at the interior offensive line spot, he is your starting right guard, plug and play.
00:05:16
You draft them right away.
00:05:17
He's going to be right there.
00:05:19
One word to describe his play.
00:05:21
He is a mauler.
00:05:22
He moves people.
00:05:24
Um, he is a people destroy your Yes, it's football.
00:05:27
You can destroy people in football.
00:05:29
He does that consistently.
00:05:31
Um, one thing would with Wyatt Davis is you look at the tape from this year a little bit less.
00:05:36
Not as good as the previous year, But his center Josh Meyers, is having to work with a new left guard and Harry Miller, and that was the confusion or the inconsistency from left guard center to right guard There was little communication error, and sometimes you saw early in the season those three were giving up the sacks.
00:05:56
I don't think the right or left tackle their Mumford or Nicolas Petit Frayer give up any sacks throughout the entire season.
00:06:02
This past year of football, Um, but why Davis? He is a guy that Giants fans will grow to love if they draft him.
00:06:10
I've seen him slaughtered in the late or early second round.
00:06:13
He could creep into the first round.
00:06:15
I do think, if there weren't so many guys that did that decided to opt out this past college football season and it did decide to play.
00:06:23
They're all great.
00:06:24
Talent will get me wrong.
00:06:25
But you see what would possibly see why Davis moved up when you don't have this past year of film for people to ****yze similar to Justin Fields, the only going off of your 2019 film.
00:06:35
So those guys Michael Parsons being one of them, not knocking him as an athlete, he's amazing, but he may get slandered like Justin Fields is right now.
00:06:44
But Wyatt Davis he's a people mover inside zone gap scheme running, blocking guy Um, phenomenal Giants fans.
00:06:51
If you guys treat him well, you guys keep him for 10 plus years.
00:06:55
Um, he is that good.
00:06:56
And he is a guy that can start on day one.
00:06:59
Jay, I have one specific question for you that all giant fans want to know.
00:07:03
Would you categorize him as a hog? Molly? Yes.
00:07:07
Okay. Okay.
00:07:08
Perfect.
00:07:09
Because we happen to know a GM.
00:07:10
We happen to know a GM that really loves hog.
00:07:13
Molly.
00:07:14
So when you said he was a mauler, a brawler, I just knew we needed to check the box for all all the people that listen to O g p.
00:07:19
He is, in fact, a hog, Molly.
00:07:21
Absolutely.
00:07:22
He fits that bill 100% well, and that's so That's the interesting thing, though, too, because you mentioned him getting up.
00:07:27
Maybe in the first round, cause what we're talking about now is a couple of points that you mentioned in there.
00:07:31
Especially around working on the offensive line for the Buckeyes and some of the different pieces alongside of him And how that may have hurt. Quote unquote.
00:07:38
You know how his tape looks.
00:07:40
But but the idea of going only back to 2019 for that.
00:07:43
If this is a player that's gonna sneak into the first round, the Giants at the top of the draft, you know my name.
00:07:48
They want to keep our eyes on them.
00:07:49
They could go defensive.
00:07:51
Player.
00:07:52
What are you? What is the gap between those guys considered higher in the first round? As far as offensive linemen Sewell, Slater, even a Vera Tucker relative to where you look at player like Wyatt Davis? And then also, what's been the impact of this covid past season? Not playing, playing coming back in? How much is that? May be damaged some of these prospects in terms of where they should fall in the draft class.
00:08:16
So the first question first as far as why Davis and being late second round? How does he stack up against the others? I think Panetta soul, um, if he didn't play, if he played and if he had a bad game or two, like Justin Fields, you're a tackle.
00:08:30
Teams need tackles automatically.
00:08:32
I don't think he's gonna get knocked and get and get the criticism that Justin Fields did due to the position that he plays and how important it is blindside protecting your quarterback.
00:08:44
That's part of the thing with with Wyatt Davis, he is an interior old lineman right guard, and the importance on the hierarchy of offensive lineman you're right guard is not as important as your left tackle.
00:08:55
Protecting the blind side is very, very important for an offensive lineman or offensive line.
00:09:00
You want to get your your quarterback, Daniel Jones, in this instance, killed on Day one.
00:09:04
So I think that that's part of the reason why.
00:09:06
Why Davis is kind of early second round, not late first round, simply the position that he plays.
00:09:12
And that's obviously the only reason if you go to the 2020 film, Yeah, like I said, you're going to find mistakes there.
00:09:18
But you're gonna play mistakes with everybody because, as I said on Friday show of loved ones.
00:09:22
But guys talking about basketball on that show.
00:09:25
But there's yet I have yet to see a perfect game.
00:09:27
I have not seen a perfect game at any level.
00:09:30
Basketball.
00:09:31
Adam, You cover the Nets.
00:09:32
So yet you have yet to see Kevin Durant shoes 100% for anything.
00:09:37
Charity stripe, maybe, but he's going to make.
00:09:39
He's gonna miss shots every game.
00:09:41
As great as he is as a basketball player, they're going to be times that he misses shots.
00:09:45
So that's not a quote unquote perfect game.
00:09:48
I I do look for perfection.
00:09:50
We don't get it 65% shooting from the field.
00:09:52
Amazing, but it's not 100%.
00:09:54
So I do think that's part of the reason there in the film, possibly, but just mainly his position.
00:09:59
But Covid was a problem.
00:10:01
I'm not sure how much we get to this later.
00:10:03
But Covid was a problem with Ohio State.
00:10:05
So I think was self induced or self called canceling games when you cancel them, not because it need to be cancelled.
00:10:12
Not going to touch the Michigan thing, because I think that's one Ohio State fans will be very, very upset about still even and what's this March 26th that happened back in November or December.
00:10:23
They'll still be upset because that game was canceled.
00:10:26
But you think about these different offseason not having a game, not having a season.
00:10:32
Why David at that time was opted out, so he really wasn't and he was in football shape.
00:10:36
Quote unquote, but not your true football shape going into a football season.
00:10:42
So then, when they reinstate the season, you get Sean Wade.
00:10:45
You get white Davis as well that opt back in.
00:10:48
So they're preparation mentally different.
00:10:51
And that could have gone into why, early in the season, mentally and physically, the communication from left guard center right guard was different because the Big 10 kind of dropped the ball and hurt hurt the team.
00:11:03
Um, but that was a big factor.
00:11:05
But as you saw the game 456 especially like three games threats for trade sermon down the down, the last part of the season where he killed the game, you saw what Ohio they can do when they're hitting on all cylinders.
00:11:17
If they had a true off season, if they had a full season, why Davis film would have been completely better? Probably would be a first rounder, not late second at the same position and you're talking.
00:11:28
So I'm actually gonna let Andy take this year because there's a couple other guys team specific needs specific for the for the Giants that were interested in we mentioned we got Adoree Jackson in free agency.
00:11:36
So it feels like we've shored that up.
00:11:38
But I know Andy looks specifically await and says What? What? What went on here? What? You know what is he What? Because I thought I saw he was Yeah, maybe he's completely not.
00:11:48
Yeah, yeah, J This was This was one of the questions that I wanted to make sure that we asked about Sean way because, you know, a couple of years ago, people were saying he was the first round player.
00:11:58
He looked amazing.
00:11:59
He decided, you know, stayed in school.
00:12:01
And, you know, I wanted to get your thoughts on how much of of his decline is one.
00:12:06
Overstated, too is related to covid.
00:12:09
Or three is because he moved from the slot position outside this year and was kind of guarding some of the bigger body wide receiver.
00:12:18
So we would love to.
00:12:19
To understand what was driving some of the regression with Sean. Wait.
00:12:23
Well, overstated his issues.
00:12:25
Not at all.
00:12:26
They were 100% there.
00:12:27
You watch the games? I watch the games.
00:12:29
You didn't re watch the tape that the problems were there.
00:12:32
Were there due to covid, maybe early, but against Penn State.
00:12:36
I don't really say that, um, week to your QB one CB one for the team you're calling.
00:12:41
You're supposed to be the guy that supposed to be there.
00:12:43
Yeah, you get a warm up game against Nebraska.
00:12:45
That's all you get, kind of like your quote unquote preseason game or high school football here where I currently live, you get a scrimmage and then the real thing The following next week, you guys are scrimmage against Nebraska.
00:12:55
The real thing came against Penn State, and you failed sometimes if you were in position at times, but then your position wasn't good enough because the right receiver was still catching the ball four touchdowns.
00:13:05
Um, a lot of it was positioned, Sean.
00:13:10
Way to me is a whole lot better inside corner, nickel corner or single high safety.
00:13:16
I do not think he's suited best for an outside corner position.
00:13:21
I think the bail mentality that he showed in the season um, giving up well, I think 78 yards off the line of scrimmage.
00:13:27
Excuse me, Is this football? Um, we're not trying to play.
00:13:29
Keep away.
00:13:30
Trying to guard the guy right in front of you.
00:13:33
um a lot of that could have been skiing because it wasn't just him.
00:13:35
Seven banks on the other side of the field was doing the same exact thing.
00:13:39
Um, not as far off at times.
00:13:41
Um, but I do think with Sean weighed a lot of it was outside corner does not suit him at all.
00:13:47
Um, I understand he's very vocal or his dad's very vocal.
00:13:51
As far as, uh, on Twitter stars what he thinks about his son, Of course, going back. Your son.
00:13:56
Um but I do think that was Sean.
00:13:58
Wait.
00:13:59
A lot of it was just being out of position not being what's comfortable, what you're best at, but also Ohio State was very limited at corner.
00:14:07
So he had to be pushed outside because they didn't have many guys that were very seasoned that were there to fill that role.
00:14:14
If he moved inside, somebody else went outside to take his place.
00:14:18
Yeah, and knowing he had those challenges, where do you project Sean? Way to go in this draft? I've seen him be a little bit all over the map because he has shown flashes, as you know, inside corner nickel corner uh, there will be coaches that will be there to come out and say we can teach him to play outside.
00:14:35
He has all the athleticism and skill to be able to do it.
00:14:38
I've seen anywhere from third round to sixth round for him.
00:14:41
You know? What's your take on where you think he goes? I mean 36 rounds.
00:14:45
Probably accurate, I'd probably say third to fifth round, Um, but if you want to be like, let's concrete and say you can't you can't pick a group that's cheating.
00:14:53
Let's just pick one round I say Fourth, Um, mainly because of last year and teams not knowing the exact spot they'll put him.
00:15:02
Will it be a single high safety? Well, maybe that's more skiing.
00:15:06
Specific will be an inside corner that could be a plug and play day one, but he'll have to get used to want to get up to speed for NFL speed, but to get back to the footwork, the technique, the hip flipping and all of the things that go into playing inside corner versus outside corner.
00:15:21
The technique is different if you pick him up and you want him to play outside corner realize he's probably not going to play Day one.
00:15:29
He may have to be playing.
00:15:30
Some special teams worked his way into the rotation.
00:15:33
Maybe that's something he wants to do.
00:15:36
But based off the film, he did it to himself.
00:15:40
I hate to be that harsh, but the film does say a lot about Sean Wade's play from this past season and what he could be in the NFL.
00:15:50
So and it's interesting because you figure maybe third round takes a little bump down because he's flashed and also maybe flash on the wrong side of it as well.
00:15:57
So he'll be interesting to watch.
00:15:58
I don't know again, Adam. Adam.
00:16:00
Let me add one thing real quick about Sean.
00:16:02
We don't make this very quick.
00:16:03
I know I talk a lot. No, no.
00:16:05
Go back to the 2019 seasons outside of him.
00:16:08
On one side, Damon Garnett outside of him on one side, Jeff Okudah.
00:16:11
So he was kind of blanket it on either side was shutdown corner there.
00:16:14
On an island you're guarding the third best receivers, sometimes a tight end.
00:16:19
You're not having to guard the other team's best receiver, so maybe 2019 you have two guys that are pros on either side of you that are helping you, and basically you're shining because they're great.
00:16:33
Maybe what we saw last year is the true Sean Wade, and that's why he's fallen.
00:16:38
And if I'm an executive or a scout, I'm wondering the same thing.
00:16:41
It's 2019.
00:16:42
Sean weighed.
00:16:43
If we have a top corner on the East on both sides, we put him in the nickel.
00:16:47
Is that we're going to get 2019? Or do we get 2020? Where if he's on an island, that's what we're going to get on our team.
00:16:55
Just last little thought.
00:16:56
I just thought about about Sean. Wait.
00:16:58
Well, interestingly enough, that could be a reason why he could be a middle round pick for the Giant.
00:17:03
Because you're talking about Adoree Jackson.
00:17:04
You're talking about Bradbury right and saying, Hey, we'll put you in that nickel package and maybe you can excel for us.
00:17:09
But if my side note to it is, it's good to hear someone who's covering a team and also willing to criticized, you know, speak honestly on a prospect, right? They'd be easy to say.
00:17:19
All these guys are first rounders.
00:17:20
My God, you'd be lucky to have any of these Buckeyes.
00:17:23
But there's a reality to wear these guys fall.
00:17:24
One of the other players that interest me and leads to a question around scheme and versatility is a player like Baron Browning.
00:17:32
I like him.
00:17:33
I like what he is as a prospect.
00:17:35
He's listed, and we'll go off of ESPN Big Board because, for sake of argument, easy for fans to wrap their head around it.
00:17:40
He's 81st on the big board right now, in terms of prospects coming into next month's draft, it's it looks like he has versatility.
00:17:49
They say that, yes, he'll have opportunity at the pro level to line up and blitz off the edge.
00:17:53
He has shown the ability to drop into zone coverage, but when they talk about ideal role, it says 43 will linebacker.
00:18:00
So if we're the Giants and we're talking about running a 34 what is the adjustment that we need to make as a giant organization? Let's say what I'll put myself in the organization.
00:18:10
I'm up there with Dave Letterman.
00:18:11
We have our conversations, I have my input, but what should we be adjusting when we look at him and say, Is there going to be an issue transitioning and in general terms, how much of the college scheme that gets played needs to be applied to where these prospects fall? And do you think that Browning is going to be may be limited by his lack of versatility? Or from what I'm reading, his versatility could actually make him a more enticing prospect for proteins.
00:18:36
When it comes to Barrett, Browning will tackle the the scheme thing first.
00:18:39
When it comes to Barrett Browning, he is more your 43 Will, um, I would not.
00:18:44
I'm hesitant to play him in an outside linebacker role in a 3434 scheme.
00:18:49
I I personally am, um, What's that? He's off my board.
00:18:53
I think it over.
00:18:55
I would be excited.
00:18:56
I thought it was an opportunity, but that's it.
00:18:58
He's done maybe inside, maybe switching from outside the inside.
00:19:01
Maybe keep him in that role.
00:19:03
Um, he is athletic and a lot of guys on the interior of the offensive line.
00:19:07
He can attack them, initiate the contact and then shed and get away quickly.
00:19:12
He is a decent decent Blitzer as well off the edge A little of the middle, but mainly off the edge. Hasn't played inside.
00:19:19
Has been an outside backer His entire time at Ohio State Did actually flipped from I think he went from will to Sam, um, from one year to another.
00:19:28
So he has played both the will and the sand backer, um, at Ohio State in college.
00:19:32
Um, very athletic guy.
00:19:35
Very gap defensive front.
00:19:36
His skill set is more for To me, it is a 43 will set.
00:19:41
Um, you could maybe slide into the sand.
00:19:42
But coverage, he's decent.
00:19:46
I'm gonna say he's amazing.
00:19:47
He's decent.
00:19:48
He is probably better than what you would expect as far as in coverage zone scheme. Good.
00:19:53
Um, there was a time or two week two against Penn State.
00:19:57
They got to go back to that game.
00:19:58
There were times that they had Penn State was on the on the hash.
00:20:02
And then they flanked out Pat Friday with their tight end, some states tight in one in this class on the other side of the field.
00:20:10
And you put Barrett Browning on that side of the field one on one on an island with one of the best tight ends and cultural ball last year, and I think at least once or twice I know at least once barren Brown and got the best of him.
00:20:24
One on one.
00:20:25
You're no safety help, no L b to help you.
00:20:27
You're just you and the tight end and barren.
00:20:30
Browning did a phenomenal job.
00:20:31
I think one was a tip ball right there in this hip hop at the entire time.
00:20:35
I'm like, Wow, that's amazing.
00:20:37
That's good.
00:20:39
But when it comes to the NFL Ohio State scheme kind of hurt the defense last year because their inability to change and the shift and to make the proper adjustments institutions when they need it to.
00:20:51
I am a little I'm hesitant.
00:20:53
Hesitant 34 will 34 outside linebacker for Barrett Browning can't happen.
00:20:58
Yes, but initially I would kind of put some pause on that.
00:21:03
That's that's interesting, because we've talked a little bit about the difference in the 34243 and the versatility even for a defensive end like Jonathan Cooper, right? You know, he models to be really good in a 43 don't know if he has the skill set to be able to switch to a 34 and play that outside linebacker and guard some of these athletic tight ends that we're talking about before.
00:21:25
Yeah.
00:21:26
Cooper, I Yeah, yeah, his hands off the ground. I'm a little hesitant.
00:21:31
Um, and if he's in a 34 set, defensive end, Um, he's not big enough for that either.
00:21:38
Um, length is there.
00:21:39
But the big the size, the more math that you would need for the d N spot.
00:21:44
I don't think he has the mass of the body that he needs to play that d n spot.
00:21:49
Could it happen for you to play outside linebacker? Yes, but then you're also wondering he hasn't been in coverage.
00:21:54
Is he quick enough? Be able to read and react easily when there's a full back over a running back coming at him? Or some or back side guard pulling around.
00:22:04
Oh, wait.
00:22:05
My air hose blew up my earhole because, well, I wasn't ready.
00:22:08
It's a new position.
00:22:09
So these are all things that Cooper if you want Cooper an outside linebacker, be my guest.
00:22:15
But I would not be in your corner trying to assist you.
00:22:18
It's weird because I mean again, we'll take a slight detour off some of these players to say Ohio State.
00:22:23
That's a big program, right? I I so often I do think about it.
00:22:27
A lot of times.
00:22:28
It's around quarterback place.
00:22:29
You know you can go back and think about Dwayne Haskins, where you come out and you go, Oh, my God, a 50 touchdown season, Good Lord and you're like right? But he's playing with some of the most talented players in the country.
00:22:39
So when you get to the pro level, what's the diminishment or what's the learning curve? Right? Natural ability only gets you so far, do you? Have you seen that just over the years of covering the Buckeyes, where you go? What I think this player is, or how much I enjoy him at the college level does not mean anything for what it's going to be at the pro level.
00:22:58
What's the impact of just being surrounded by quality players as opposed to as we know for safer Giants fans Daniel Jones do quarterback? We all know what he had or did not have at the wide receiver position and you try to base it on purely talent and skill evaluation, as opposed to some of the flashy things you see on tape that can be misled by the quality of the team and the program overall.
00:23:20
So I'll take one name When you started talking about Ohio State, the talent and then translating to the NFL Ezekiel Elliott think about what? The kind of running back that he was at Ohio State to run that he had, um, Big 10 Championship.
00:23:34
The Sugar Bowl, the championship game you're beating? Uh oh, my gosh, I forget the quarterback's name.
00:23:41
Cardo Jones, Because off the bench, third string quarterback, I believe that year.
00:23:45
Phenomenal three game stretch.
00:23:48
Well, Ezekiel Elliott came back the very next year, and it was still one of the best, if not the best running backs in college football and back to back seasons.
00:23:57
Get down, Get down in Dallas, a lot of money able to eat very good.
00:24:02
You're you're in Dallas or the lock or you want to get beautiful weather.
00:24:05
All of the time looks a little hefty at times running the ball, not the same type of mentality.
00:24:12
I think that he had at Ohio State now.
00:24:14
Is that the pro mentality? The pro lifestyle has to take it over.
00:24:17
Has he always been like this? I don't know.
00:24:19
I don't I never met the guy.
00:24:20
I don't know him personally, but if you were to tell me that there's one guy to go to go over and translate from Ohio State to the NFL and be amazing, it would be it would have been a particular Elliot hands down immediately over the past few years.
00:24:33
I look at Zeke and I think something just isn't clicking right now.
00:24:38
I don't know if it's coaching.
00:24:40
I don't know if it's him.
00:24:41
I don't know if people in this corner I don't know.
00:24:44
But Zeke was a guy that everybody, I don't say you're always speaks of people.
00:24:48
I thought translating media, he had good success early on, but of late, it just seems like there's something off with this play.
00:24:57
J.
00:24:58
I love to hear that we could probably talk at nauseum about the Dallas Cowboys and the struggles that they have had and the dumpster fire that they had on defense last year.
00:25:07
Um, but when you when you bring up the running back position.
00:25:10
It's a perfect transition for us because while the Giants are hoping to have a sequel, Barkley come back healthy this year.
00:25:16
Um, they let Winkelmann go.
00:25:18
Um, there is a little bit of an opening and room for another running back, and I've talked with Adam about Trey sermon being a potential fit there.
00:25:28
Can you talk a little bit about his playmaking ability? What you think teams are going to get in someone like Trey Sermon.
00:25:35
6 ft, even £213? This is coming from I believe that the draft network dot com That's where I got there.
00:25:42
Um, the at least the stats for the height and weight before coming home with you guys.
00:25:46
I want at least get something accurate from what the Scouts are looking at and calculating right now.
00:25:51
Inside zone scheme.
00:25:52
Once again, it's very similar to Wyatt Davis.
00:25:54
Um, one thing I stuck out with me with Trey sermon this year wasn't as consistent on third down as you would like, but 1st and 2nd down.
00:26:05
Phenomenal guy, uh, physical.
00:26:07
He has very good balance.
00:26:08
Ball security.
00:26:09
Is there another key thing about him? He played at Oklahoma and he played at Ohio State, never had over 200 plus carries during any season in college, so he has a lot of tread on the tires that is still left us a quant Barkley there.
00:26:25
Hopefully, he stays healthy.
00:26:26
If he stays healthy, that's a good 12 punch with sermon and with sermon.
00:26:31
He's gonna be a later round pick, possibly Day three picks.
00:26:35
So you're not having to spend a lot of money early in the draft to get him.
00:26:39
You can drag him late, get them cheaper, Um, get a contract friendly deal with him, especially for a rookie.
00:26:45
Um, that could be very, very good and consistent for you early in the year.
00:26:50
For those of you that say, Ohio State trade sermon came on late, why didn't he come on early? Trace someone early in the season.
00:26:56
Part of that thing was, I believe Ohio State automatically wanted to trust the guy that was running back.
00:27:04
That was a running back at the school the year prior, simply due to Covid.
00:27:08
I think, Adam, you brought that up earlier.
00:27:09
The fact that Covid had on the football team and the football season this year, Trey Sermon had a full off season.
00:27:16
I think we would have seen more of the late season trey sermon early in the football season, because that's how the electric once he figured out his groove and what's the offensive line, got the communication errors corrected.
00:27:30
You saw Trey sermon go off, go smooth off, and I loved every second of it.
00:27:37
I was hired him coming into Ohio State high on him.
00:27:40
Now I'll be hiding him.
00:27:41
In the NFL.
00:27:42
There is one is one of those guys.
00:27:44
He's just easy to love, fun to watch.
00:27:47
He has great balance.
00:27:48
He is strong.
00:27:49
Ball security is there.
00:27:50
I do think one thing that they did not take advantage of with him, and I'll close out with this.
00:27:55
He can catch the ball out of the backfield.
00:27:57
And so I was kind of curious to see how Ohio State's offense, when they go back to the Oklahoma style, how the occasionally catch the ball out of the backfield.
00:28:04
58 10 yard game 10.
00:28:06
Maybe on the longer end of that, but he's still moving, moving the change, moving the ball, or would they just keep doing what they had, and he didn't really use them out the back field like I thought.
00:28:15
But with that, one more thing I keep.
00:28:17
There's so much kind of my mind when I think about Trey sermon.
00:28:19
He is very, very good, I think in the first guy missed and actually getting yards after contact.
00:28:26
Another thing that in the NFL, if you get contact, you want someone to be able to move after that happens.
00:28:32
So I'll be really curious, too, because you think about adding him into as a complimentary piece, right when you when you talk about some third down struggles, well, that might be the area where the Giants want to be able to use someone to spell Sequana Barkley for stretches.
00:28:44
But you highlight the ability to come out of the backfield and catch passes.
00:28:47
I think now the Giants are building towards versatility and a lot of their weapons.
00:28:51
So are running back.
00:28:52
Listen, we we got Booker earlier for the agency.
00:28:54
To the dismay of Giants fans talked about with Andy, they were disgusted.
00:28:58
Thankfully, they cleaned it up with all the other signings.
00:29:00
But you already have, right? You have, say Kwan Barkley.
00:29:03
You have a veteran experience backup that can do a lot of good things for you.
00:29:06
So maybe especially, like you said, if it's a Day three opportunity, this could be that, you know, quote unquote kind of quiet steel that you can get and allow him to develop.
00:29:14
You can take the first six weeks of the season to find out what your role is going to be.
00:29:17
There's not gonna be a huge expectation for him coming in, so maybe there's an opportunity to steal.
00:29:21
I'm gonna try to avoid saying quote unquote anymore.
00:29:24
In this episode, I didn't know I could do it three times over a 30 minute stretch.
00:29:27
But before and he gets to, I think he has one more than you might be interested in.
00:29:31
If not, I just want to get to kind of your overall who you think would be the best prospect.
00:29:36
Regardless of where they're taking right, who is going to be the greatest value for a team in the NFL.
00:29:40
The last guy because Joe Judge is a team guy, he's a character guy.
00:29:46
We saw this last season with some late round selections, guy that I called for Carter.
00:29:50
Coughlin came in special teams contributor.
00:29:53
Lot of former captains have gotten selected by the Giants going back to last year.
00:29:57
Tough Borland.
00:29:58
Here's a gentleman that by all accounts, is going to be limited.
00:30:01
The skill set isn't exactly what you call a pro level ready and yet was the captain for the Buckeyes.
00:30:08
He's listed as depth linebacker and special teams contributor and really core special teams contributor.
00:30:15
He's, I mean, Peter, speak to from an Ohio State standpoint, what was his value to that team as a leader? Because I think that those are some of the intangible things that this guy an organization, has looked to pivot to.
00:30:25
And it's just always interesting when you talk about really across the league, right.
00:30:30
Guys that on on tape have no business being a pro for 57 10 years and yet somehow always find a role for themselves.
00:30:38
Does Borland potentially fall into that into that niche for a late round pick that that any team would be excited to have late round pick? And I say late, I mean, lately, I mean, like, maybe late sixth round, probably seventh.
00:30:51
I'm leaning more towards If he gets drafted his seventh round more.
00:30:55
An undrafted free agent style.
00:30:57
Another cheap, cheap, cheap pickup.
00:31:00
I mean, he is a special teams guy that you can pick up right away.
00:31:03
Day one special teams core guy.
00:31:07
Get him there.
00:31:08
He's going to get acclimated.
00:31:09
He's going to get up to speed.
00:31:10
He is very, very good at stuff in a like in the trenches in college, if you want to. Inside linebackers.
00:31:19
6 ft 2 29 in the NFL.
00:31:21
He not the tallest he has physical, Not the quickest.
00:31:25
There was a video going around to the Senior Bowl, where the it was a fullback, tough boiling on the inside linebacker spot.
00:31:31
Fullback does like a quick out going to going to the flat.
00:31:34
You can tell tough Boiling was struggling to get there, but that's what you're going to have.
00:31:39
He's just not that kind of skill.
00:31:41
Set to like Oh, inside linebacker Can tough fall and come in and play right away. No.
00:31:46
Can it be a backup? Yes, but you better have another backup behind him.
00:31:50
Hoping that does not continue to be there very, very long.
00:31:55
I like tough boiling a lot, Captain solid helps the younger guys is what the L.
00:32:00
B coach at Ohio State recently said to the media.
00:32:02
I think it was yesterday that came out, but with tough boiling, I'm going to pump the brakes on anything that's inside the football field of defensive side Right now, if you want to buy special teams, a core guy consistently, that's going to be there.
00:32:16
A hard worker, a guy that's going to be there to heal, figure out.
00:32:20
He'll learn the scheme very quickly.
00:32:22
He'll figure everything out that he needs to do on day one day, two day, three day four, a glue guy, a guy that's going to be there.
00:32:30
That may be a captain on the special teams.
00:32:32
At some point, I don't know that stuff.
00:32:34
Boiling 34 scheme, Not him.
00:32:37
43 scheme worked in college.
00:32:40
His skill set doesn't work in the NFL.
00:32:42
I'm convinced that Adam wanted to ask about tough Borland just because of his name.
00:32:47
I'm convinced that's what I want to take one to go with here.
00:32:51
Carter Coughlin Last year.
00:32:52
Tom Coughlin, Coughlin.
00:32:54
I knew I needed there, you know, J.
00:32:57
One other question that we had and then we'll let you get out of here.
00:33:00
Um, you talked about how tough boiling is not gonna pop off the screen. He's not.
00:33:04
You know, he's a glue type of guy.
00:33:06
You have the Ohio State Pro Day coming up.
00:33:08
You have the combine and all that stuff.
00:33:09
I don't know how they're gonna try to figure that out this year.
00:33:12
Can you tell me of all the Ohio State guys, is there one guy that you think when he runs the 40 or does the bench presser does the high jump that is just gonna pop off the screen? And people are gonna be like, Wow, I didn't know that guy was that athletic or conversely, is there a guy maybe that plays better than than potentially he's gonna run or show out, you know, during during some of these pro days.
00:33:33
So I'm gonna cheat and I'm gonna do to, uh, everyone to cheat in a way, that's kind of like, okay, because it's at the other position.
00:33:41
I wanna go for the skill set. Justin Fields.
00:33:43
I think his speed when he was just 40 I think everybody will be surprised at how fast straight line speed.
00:33:50
He has, um, I think the one guy that will surprise people, mainly because he had an injury riddled college career.
00:33:58
Um, he was he was 1/6 year senior due to medically being registered.
00:34:02
ID Justin Hilliard.
00:34:04
Think about a guy that's a captain who doesn't start.
00:34:08
That's just in Hilliard.
00:34:09
That's the kind of guy he is late in the season, I think.
00:34:12
Adam, I know you for sure.
00:34:13
You did mention the Covid stuff during this past season.
00:34:16
Well, Hilliard had to come in late in the season and start because of Covid.
00:34:21
Players were ineligible.
00:34:22
He was able to come in and play, and he played very, very well.
00:34:25
A lot of the key plays and reason in Ohio State, um, main players down the stretch against Northwestern and the Big 10 championship game were because of Hilliard.
00:34:33
He also be a limited play, even though he had limited play led the team in tackles for loss.
00:34:40
That's huge.
00:34:42
I don't know how many games you started this year, but it was not very many.
00:34:46
Ohio State did play enough games to play, uh, to count them on two hands or what people are saying Oh, House.
00:34:51
They didn't play any games.
00:34:52
They did play games.
00:34:53
They played enough to fit two hands in this past season.
00:34:56
I'm pretty sure Justin, who only played enough to fit them on one hand, and he had a lot of the team with TfL with five.
00:35:03
Justin hired, I think, from what I saw, the Senior Bowl, what I heard raised his draft stock.
00:35:09
Justin Hilliard.
00:35:10
I believe it is.
00:35:11
Pros Day will raise his draft stock more than anybody on Ohio State.
00:35:15
That's at the pro day coming up, I believe on Tuesday.
00:35:19
Good Lord.
00:35:20
Better the wealth of information.
00:35:22
Um, we want to give you a second here to tell everybody where you're at, but this is two second response.
00:35:27
Is Justin Fields still going to suffer if he runs a really good 40 time? Are we still going to do that thing where we insist that fast quarterbacks need to change positions when they get to the pros? Because those murmurs to start to come out of this guy runs too fast.
00:35:40
They'll say you should be a wide receiver at what point the NFL is shifting, but at what point is going to stop and say he played quarterback his entire career.
00:35:47
That's what he's going to be like.
00:35:48
Why is there still this obsession was saying, If you're quick, though, you should probably stop throwing that football.
00:35:53
I don't think so because of the statement you made at the very end.
00:35:56
You supply, stop throwing the football.
00:35:58
People know Fields can make all the throws.
00:36:00
That's not a question.
00:36:01
Mark is our strength.
00:36:02
His arm talent isn't a question mark.
00:36:04
His question mark is.
00:36:06
How does he use his legs to maneuver in the pocket and to scramble to get extra yards? Does he does he throw them? When he threw the ball away? That does.
00:36:14
He? When will he finally throw the ball away? And then also, it's more mental than physical and fields.
00:36:21
He has all the physical traits he's not.
00:36:23
I mean, he's not short.
00:36:25
He was stocky.
00:36:26
He's 30 hard to take down for him.
00:36:28
It's more mental.
00:36:29
I am curious early on who will help him figure out, or if somebody will help him figure out how to decipher pre snap the zone or the coverage that the defense has at that time.
00:36:41
Pre snap read post nap verification.
00:36:44
He may get a pre snap but post snap too many times.
00:36:47
He does not.
00:36:49
And this is my my consistent opinion around the NFL in general.
00:36:52
I know some guys come in and flash very early.
00:36:54
I still believe that getting a quarterback with time behind the veteran is always going to be.
00:36:59
There's monumental to the success that the quarterback can have in the long term future.
00:37:03
So you guys can flash early and they can figure it out.
00:37:05
But having that experience ahead, you can always help.
00:37:07
All right, this has been amazing.
00:37:09
We, of course, appreciate your time.
00:37:11
Remind the folks where they can find J.
00:37:12
Stevens across the many platforms and podcasts and avenues and efforts.
00:37:16
Because I said it before, I had a great time talking nets basketball on your podcast.
00:37:21
This has been amazing.
00:37:22
I mean, more people, if they're not already need to be hearing you.
00:37:25
You guys can follow me on Twitter before I do that. Thank you guys.
00:37:28
So much for coming.
00:37:29
Let me come on here.
00:37:30
The podcast coming on against my own podcast for me to come on here.
00:37:34
The one giant podcast.
00:37:35
This has been a lot of fun.
00:37:36
I think you guys can tell.
00:37:37
I've been itching and scratching and clawing to talk football, and this gives you like football itch for the weekend before I record some more locked on Buckeye stuff on Monday.
00:37:47
Locked the Buckeyes.
00:37:48
Follow me there, Um, every Monday through Friday, dropping a fresh new episode for you talking about a lot of Buckeye football spring game coming up.
00:37:55
So we're gearing up for that.
00:37:57
Follow me on Twitter at J Steven 07 Pretty active.
00:38:00
I will follow back on the host of the J.
00:38:02
Stevens podcast.
00:38:03
Adam was on there.
00:38:04
Um recently had a previous to interview Hide your trophy winner on Charlie Ward.
00:38:09
Um, also play in the NBA as well.
00:38:11
So check that interview out.
00:38:13
And then Monday's on Locked on Big 10 myself.
00:38:17
Ben Stevens called the Stevens and Stephen Show, and we have a fun time recapping what took place.
00:38:23
Um, in the weekend that was in Big 10 sports.
00:38:27
Jay, thank you so much for the insights around some of the prospects that big blue fans can start to keep their eye on heading to the draft next month. Follow him.
00:38:34
Listen to him.
00:38:35
We appreciate your time.
00:38:36
We, of course, will get back on together soon to hash up football. Basketball.
00:38:40
Just sports in general.
00:38:41
Much appreciate it, man.
00:38:43
Yes, it was fun, man.
00:38:44
Thanks, guys, for having me on.
00:38:47
Yeah, yeah, yeah Mhm Mhm, yeah, yeah, sure, Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah

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